Question

Photo of Frank Franklin

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Can I install Rock RMS on Windows 7 or 10? How?

Can I install and test Rock on a Windows 7 or 10 computer? I tried downloading Rock RMS from GitHub but the size of the file was intimidating - it was more than 500 Mega Byte. Does it mean that to test Rock on a computer, one has to download that large file? What if after downloading the large file and after testing, how possible is it to move such a huge file from the computer to the Web host server? Is there no better way of installing and testing Rock on the computer first. How can a Windows 7 or 10 be configured in order to install and test Rock? What if the computer already has Visual Studio 2015 Community Edition installed on the computer, is this enough to install and configure Rock on the PC?

  • Photo of Michael Garrison

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     Frank, welcome to Rock!

    The best way to install Rock is to get it from the rockrms.com homepage rather than Github - that download is MUCH smaller and is the intended out-of-box experience.

    I THINK that it's possible to install Rock on Windows 7 or Windows 10, provided you have IIS and SQL Server installed (check with the licensing requirements for the free SQL Server Express to make sure it's legal on those platforms). Visual Studio is not required for normal installation and use of Rock. Read the "Internal Hosting" manual for the full process http://www.rockrms.com/Rock/BookContent/1/73

    If you decide to take that installation public, you'll want to perform the same download/installation process on your new host, then back up your local SQL database and restore it to the new host. Unless you're making some serious (code or file-level) changes, your information usually all lives in the database.

    However, if you just want to test Rock, you can play and tweak to your heart's content on the demo server at http://rock.rocksolidchurchdemo.com  

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Thank you so much for your response.

    Downloading Rock from rockrms.com shows that the file is 5.19KB. So meaning that when I run the installation, it will still download the same size of that of GitHub which is more than 500MB.

    Now the question is what is now the difference? What if as it downloads during installation and my network gets bad, it might mean that I will have to start all over again. But I think with IDM, downloading from GitHub can help me pause the download if network gets bad. Or is there something you are not telling me that I need to know?

    Also, the reason why I wanted to download from GitHub is because I will have access to the files so I can make necessary modification if I need to during testing on my PC. Or with the one downloaded from rock site and after installation, will I get access to all the files? Can I modify the files if I want on my PC before moving the files to the server? Please whats the size of the file after installation from rock site?

    I have tried rock.rocksolidchurchdemo.com severally but like I said, I need to have complete control of what am testing like having access to the files and knowing what is where.

    So are having installed Visual Studio 2015 Community Edition is not enough to install and test Rock on the PC?

    • Michael Garrison

      I'm not sure that it downloads all of that- there is a lot more in GitHub than is necessary to run Rock. That said, I don't know myself how large the download actually is, nor can I answer how large Rock is once installed- I have backups and misc files in my own directory so it's somewhat larger than a vanilla installation would be. I cannot answer myself as to the "how" or whether an interrupted connection will simply continue once restored rather than restarting.


      As to the "What is the difference" question: the biggest thing off the top of my head is that you need to have the installation routines run so that your church's information gets put in correctly ahead of time (url, name, org e-mail, etc) and perhaps more importantly, the database tables get created during the OOBE. I don't think that simply syncing the files down will do that.


      Once Rock is installed, all of the files are indeed on your computer and you could edit them. HOWEVER, it's usually not necessary to do so. Indeed, it's usually rather ill-advised to do so unless you're going to create pull requests to get your changes back into core, as the files can and will be overwritten at the next update.


      Rather, Rock customization is usually done from WITHIN rock, rather than editing files. You create new pages, add blocks to the pages, add content and people, etc, from the web interface, and those changes are stored in the SQL database, not in the C# source files you see on the computer.


      So it depends on how much you're expecting to be customizing. Start with working on the customizations available from within Rock itself, and when you hit a snag (and after you've confirmed there's no "normal" way to do what you need from within Rock), consider writing a plugin in Visual Studio, rather than modifying core files.


      Which brings me to another link: http://www.rockrms.com/Developer =)


      Visual Studio is not enough to install and test Rock on your PC. Indeed, it's not a requirement at all. You need IIS and SQL Server (express is fine, and is free, but again check the licensing as I'm unsure whether it's only licensed for server OS or not). Read through the "Internal Hosting" manual I linked to previously for more information on the installation.

    • Michael Garrison

      FYI I just had an opportunity to install Rock fresh on a new server- the vanilla installation came in at around 140mb for me. I know it downloads a series of .zip files though so it's entirely possible the actual download is even less than the actual installation.

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Please what's OOBE?

    Please can you give just steps on how to do the following:

    1. How can I modify "Crafted by the Spark Development Network / License" which is located at the button/footer left of the page here: http://rock.rocksolidchurchdemo.com?

    2. How can I modify "Powered by: Rock RMS" and "3120 W Cholla St Phoenix, AZ 850293120 W Cholla St Phoenix, AZ 85029" which are located at the button/footer of the page here: http://www.rocksolidchurchdemo.com?

    3. Also, can the loading image be changed and how? I think answering these questions helps solve the problem. Also, are you saying that EVERYTHING is stored in the database, including images, videos, etc?

    So are you also saying that: lets say if I install Rock on our computer or server and people created accounts, uploaded their PHOTOS, etc. And then if we decide to make it public by moving it to a different server like the web host, are you saying that the ONLY thing I need to backup and move is JUST the database? So I do NOT need to move the files too to the new server? So I just have to make a fresh installation on the other server and then just update the newly installed Rock on the new host with just with our own database? If I dont move the files to the the new servers, what about things like the users' photos? So are you saying that NO changes are made to any of Rock's file except the database?

    Can someone with basic ASP.NET MVC C# knowledge easily right plugins since Rock was developed using ASP.NET's ASPX if am correct.

    Once again, thanks for your response. I appreciate them all.

    • Michael Garrison

      Sorry, OOBE=Out-of-box-experience (setup)


      1: That's just an HTML block, using the "Blocks" button on the Admin toolbar, you can add content there. Consider leaving the Spark credit there though, since it includes a link to the licenses which you may need to refer to, and since this is a page only for your internal use, it's not hurting anything. It will REALLY help you as you explore Rock to have read the manuals as I recommended above.
      2: Powered by Rock- see the answer above. Address: will be set during setup, or can be removed as above.
      3: Yes, it can be changed- it's all block settings.


      See http://rock.rocksolidchurchdemo.com/page/150 for a list of what file types are stored where. It looks like the default is that everything except audio and video files are stored in the Database. So yes, in general you would just need to restore your backup to a fresh Rock installation (of matching version number), re-load any plugins you've created or purchased through the shop, upload any video/audio files (unless you change those to be stored in the database as well), you'll be good to go.


      Note that I believe there are plugins to add file locations, such as AWS, so that the files would actually not need to be transferred, nor add size to your database- you may want to look into that.


      Yes, look at the developers link above- if you know C#, you'll be able to create plugins. But I think you may be surprised at how extensible Rock is even without plugins.

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Greetings, 

    Please what's FYI? What's vanilla installation and how do I go about this? Please what's the difference between actual download and actual installation? 

    Are you saying that you downloaded a new copy of rock that you installed on a new server (web host) and the size is just 140MB? Please where and how can I download it too and I hope I can install and test on a local PC?

    Thank you so much for your responses. I can't thank you enough. I really appreciate. 

    • Michael Garrison

      FYI = For Your Information


      Vanilla installation means initial installation, no plugins, data or edits. It's a "pure" untouched fresh install.


      Yes, I downloaded a new copy of Rock to a new server (web host) from rockrms.com, and after installation was done I checked the size of the directory on the server and it was just 140MB.

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Wow! Thanks for your wonderful answer. So amazingly easy to understand and straight to the point. 

    So with that, I can zip or archive the installation should I want to install in another server without having to redownload from the rockrms.com?

    Does it mean that there's nothing like an all in one server just like Wamp or XAMPP used for php if I want to easily install Rock on my local PC instead of going through setting up Windows server? Also for development purposes, is Visual Studio Community Edition 2015 just enough to develop on Rock? 

    Thank you so much. 

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    I am still having difficulties setting up the server on Windows 10 in order to install Rock RMS. I have installed Server Manager on Windows 10 and followed the guide here www.rockrms.com/Rock/BookContent/1/73 but I cant add Roles and Features in Server Manager. Please I need help.

    • Michael Garrison

      Quite right. To install Internet Information Services (IIS), you'll need to go to "Add and Remove Programs" and then click "Turn Windows Features on or off" and check the box next to IIS. Be sure to get any of the sub-items that are listed in the documentation too. The .NET 3.5 features it lists may be in that dialogue as well, or you may just need to download it directly from Microsoft.

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Thank you for your reply.

    I have installed IIS as you have instructed but its still not working.

    This is becoming frustrating. Please I still need help.

    Does it mean that nobody has installed Rock RMS on Windows PC such as Windows 7, 8 or 10?

    • Michael Garrison

      Probably not- Rock is designed to run on Windows Server, not the client editions of Windows. At this point I think you'll be better off abandoning the idea and look into hosted options instead.

  • Photo of Frank Franklin

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    Thank you for your reply.

    Please can I install Windows Server on Windows 10 PC so I can be able to install and test Rock?

  • Photo of Ken Neal

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    Yes, you can install RockRMS on a Windows 10 PC! We have been using it at our very small church for nearly a year, and it has worked flawlessly. That being said, there are a couple of caveats. First, please don't use a Windows 10 PC as an Internet facing server; you will be hacked. Only use a Windows 10 PC for testing purposes or internal (intranet) access only. Second, the IIS web server in Windows 10 is not designed to support a large number of simultaneous connections. If you plan to have multiple kiosks for check-in, etc., this probably isn't going to work well for you.

    From this point, I'm assuming you have a valid use case, so all you need to do is substitute Installing Windows Features below for the Installing Server Roles & Features section of the Rock Solid Internal Hosting guide.

    Installing Windows Features

    In this chapter, we'll install the additional required Windows features needed for Rock. Once opened, the first thing we need to do is to install the Web Server role. That can be done by from the Control Panel by clicking on Programs and then Turn Windows features on or off.

    Select the following features and all sub-components:
    · .NET Framework 3.5 (includes .NET 2.0 and 3.0)
    · .NET Framework 4.6 Advanced Services

    Under the Internet Information Services feature, select the following items:
    · Web Management Tools -> IIS Management Scripts and Tools
    · World Wide Web Services -> Application Development Features -> ASP .NET 3.5
    · World Wide Web Services -> Common HTTP Features -> Static Content

    Note: The additional checked items in the image below are selected by default in Windows 10 as I started with a freshly installed computer that is to become our new Rock server. Some of these may be required. If you have previously removed them, or they have somehow become de-selected, you may need to re-add them.

    Click OK.

    RockRMS_Win10_Windows_Features.png

    If prompted, click Download files from Windows Update.

    Once the download and installation is complete, click Close.


    Good luck and God bless!


    Best regards,

    Ken Neal

    Pinecroft Baptist Church